User talk:Deborahjay

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Note[edit source]

Hi Debora, you're doing a good job in this wikipedia, I show up here once a week. If you need to delete some page leave a note in my Talk page (Ingxoxo), I also don't know the language. Best DARIO SEVERI (talk) 02:38, 7 uNcwaba 2017 (UTC)

RE: User talk:DARIO SEVERI#A set of 109 Articles for Deletion with low relevance in ZU WP[edit source]

Hi Deborahjay

It's a rather difficult issue because it's a Wikipedia with less than 1000 articles. Three weeks ago I contacted one of the editors of one of the small wikipedia because I thought about eliminating an article just like these and he replied "This Wikipedia does not delete anything." Their fear is that by having a few articles end up closing their Wikipedia.

I noticed that there are two other active editors here in the last 30 days, JMK and Fiso.dlamini, and because their editions seem to know the language well, let's see what they think about it. I left a note on their Talk pages [1]. I'll write to you soon. DARIO SEVERI (talk) 01:54, 18 uNcwaba 2017 (UTC)

Well ... I checked it better, I noticed that the article Nepal created by him differs very little from I-Afganistani created five years ago, the vast majority of articles here would not survive in English wikipedia. I believe the best it's leaves them hoping that little by little others will improve them. I'm going to improve Nepal, I've been 5 times there, love it. DARIO SEVERI (talk) 02:12, 18 uNcwaba 2017 (UTC)
Thanks for sharing your perspective, that's so helpful in reorienting my efforts for short-term follow-up:
  • Improve those articles: correct and add categories per EN WP, also some basic expanded content (genre, year of founding)
  • Add the above content to the corresponding Wikidata item
  • Contact those pages' creator suggesting a focus on adding pages relating to the Zulu people and Southern Africa
I see the value of avoiding page deletions. My main concern, besides wikifying pages and developing an appropriate category structure, is adding, organizing and expanding relevant content in geography and biography; the performing arts and sports tend to grow with fans' contributions. I'll add this explanation to my User page to explain my activity in ZU WP for the sake of the curious. :-D -- Deborahjay (talk) 13:17, 18 uNcwaba 2017 (UTC)

Intro from User:Fiso.dlamini[edit source]

Guys, I have just joined Wikipedia and I am still familiarizing myself with this platform. I have read and understand what you are saying here. I am a native speaker of Zulu language. I will recruit a few of my Zulu friends to address this. I have seen a lot of wrongs in Zulu articles. Lots of direct translations etc.

Like I said, guys, I am new to the Wikipedia platform and I will need your help.

Fiso.dlamini (talk) 13:48, 18 uNcwaba 2017 (UTC) Fiso Dlamini

Junk content and ...[edit source]

Hi Debora

  • Congratulations! Are you researching a lot, yes ... all pages created by Heleen was junk content, I deleted them and blocked the editor.
  • I think you should add your name in the list Wikipedia:Local Embassy, after adding #language:sq (sq), but that page is rarely consulted, the list is very outdated, there are editors in it that have not edited for years. I read that you intend starting a WikiProject I really do not know how to do it, and I think it would only have the two of us collaborating on it but it does not hurt to try :)
  • I noted you edited 380 times in the last 30 days, doing many important things ... can I ask you a question? Why did you choose the Zulu language? Several times I meet editors who alone are trying to improve one of the projects, in the Wikipedia mirandesa [2] there is a young girl [3] improving him practically alone. I wrote so much today. Please contact me if you find more things to delete. Best regards. DARIO SEVERI (talk) 02:07, 22 uNcwaba 2017 (UTC
Hello again, Dario, and thanks for such a quick turnaround! It's great having you as a qualified resource person.
  • I'm exploring the ZU WP using either a systematic or a spontaneous approach. I started with "Load a random page" and just yesterday discovered "Special pages." As you've seen and are welcome to follow: much can be cleaned up using just English and Copy/Paste.
  • At the w:WP:Local Embassy I signed up for ZU as you suggested, though still haven't gotten a reply from my query on its Talk page. Meanwhile, in the style of a WikiProject, I've set up a few Talk pages to post and track suggested activity. Adding content with "New section" allows structured commenting. These pages are linked with explanations on my page User:Deborahjay#Focus list.
  • It's delightful to read about mwl:Utilizadora:Athena in Wonderland - in a language whose existence was unknown to me till now! I'll definitely write to her with encouragement: she and I are WP soul-sisters!
I'll be glad to get back to you as situations emerge. -- Cheers, Deborahjay (talk) 18:29, 22 uNcwaba 2017 (UTC)
Oh, and Dario -- see my answer to why I chose the ZU WP! :-D Deborahjay (talk) 01:21, 24 uNcwaba 2017 (UTC)
Oh! Yes, I already read this on your user page, even read the Johnny Clegg and Isicathamiya articles, I didn't know them. I read your message below, I will also be away for about three weeks from September 27, I travel to Nepal on "vacation". Cheers, DARIO SEVERI (talk) 01:56, 24 uNcwaba 2017 (UTC)

Seminar on The Way[edit source]

Hi Deb, I will spend less time on Wikipedia these days. I am preparing for a Business Seminar I will be hosting 9 September. unsigned comment by User:Fiso.dlamini (talk) 20:41, 22 uNcwaba 2017

Same here - I do have actual jobs sometimes, and a book translation corrections file will arrive soon, due "end of Summer" = mid-September or earlier. Meanwhile I'm making fine progress here in the ZU WP. Good going with your seminar! I'll watch for your return here. -- Deborahjay (talk) 15:30, 23 uNcwaba 2017 (UTC)

Template[edit source]

Hi Deborahjay, I made a small change in the Template:Izilwane [4], I think now it is OK, write to me if something is still wrong. DARIO SEVERI (talk) 15:29, 14 uMandulo 2017 (UTC)

You must be pleased with the results of the emptied REDIRECT category - I felt so relieved to see it! Thanks so much for the successful fix! -- Deborahjay (talk) 19:16, 14 uMandulo 2017 (UTC)

Meta - Template[edit source]

Hi Deborahjay, I read your message on Meta, thanks for mentioning me. I copied the template "Reply to" (testing: @DARIO SEVERI:) from Wiki (en) but I'm not sure if that's what you wanted because we have already something similar here the User:DARIO SEVERI. Anyway I already imported it, if you think that we do not need it let me know that I delete it (too much "it" in a sentence ... I think I should improve my English :) ).

I'll take the opportunity to let you know that from the 26th of this month I'm going to be unable to access the whole Wiki project for approximately 4 weeks. As soon as I get back I'll come to see if I can help with something. Best regards DARIO SEVERI (talk) 05:19, 15 uMandulo 2017 (UTC)

Sawubona[edit source]

Sawubona, ungangisiza ukuthi ngithuthukise lokhu. Siyabonga: Teide.-- 12:38, 12 uMfumfu 2017 (UTC)

Back to Wikibreak[edit source]

Hi Deborahjay, I still in Nepal but in this village I found a good internet connection and no expensive so I am back :) anyway on 17 I will be back to Kathmandu. I didn't understand very well about the meaning of the project they want created, I wiil read it more careful later. Cheers DARIO SEVERI (talk) 02:30, 14 uMfumfu 2017 (UTC)

Hi Debora ... (probably this is your name) Good guess - it's Deborah.. I read the article's discussion page (Injakazi), and deleted it. If you need something urgent, write to me or mention me. Cheers DARIO SEVERI (talk) 08:48, 25 uLwezi 2017 (UTC)
User:DARIO SEVERI, thanks for stopping by and grasping the need :- ) Always good to have you aboard. I'll leave you a message on your Meta Talk page since I started a query there yesterday. Otherwise, if you'd kindly clear out the Category:Candidates for speedy deletion - those build up at a rate of 1-3/month. Cheers -- Deborahjay (talk) 08:45, 26 uLwezi 2017 (UTC)
I used the Italian form Debora but now I know your correct name. I deleted the five pages that were in the category 'Candidates for speedy deletion'. I read what you wrote on the talk page on Meta [5], as Stryn mentioned there's not much we can do, I have deleted several of these spam but they continue to create them using different IPs ... I'll continue deleting them. Cheers DARIO SEVERI (talk) 09:59, 26 uLwezi 2017 (UTC)

Air[edit source]

Hi Deborah, you are right sometimes I follow so much the Be bold ... probably for editing in several Wikipedias that do not have administrators and can not wait for help, mainly in other African languages as IsiXhosa [6]. Cheers, DARIO SEVERI (talk) 00:05, 4 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

Queries from User:Metrónomo[edit source]

Hi Deborahjay:

Merge of Usuku basebenzi with Usuku lwabasebenzi[edit source]

this edit was by m:Steward requests/Miscellaneous#Merge history in -- Metrónomo (talk) 20:26, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

@Metrónomo:, I read your discussion at Meta:Steward requests (per link) and added a note there. I revised your Merge thus: The Usuku Lwabasebenzi page creator is a new editor who didn't relate to the prior existence of the stub Usuku basebenzi. Apparently the newer page name is correct and all the content of the older page already exists in the newer one. So I made the older page a redirect to the newer one. (See Edit histories and Compare versions for details.) -- Deborahjay (talk) 21:22, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)
Reply. Cheers, Metrónomo (talk) 21:33, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

Category name Eminyakeni vs. Iminyaka[edit source]

Another question, you understands Zulu language? Category:Eminyakeni is named correctly? Or the correct name is Category:Iminyaka? --Metrónomo (talk) 20:26, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

I'm studying the Zulu language as I edit, using the Oxford English-Isizulu School Dictionary and Google Translate, plus I consult with native speakers when possible. Mainly I stick to what I'm fairly sure of, and I'm a fast and accurate typist when it comes to revisions. As for the category name - your suggestion seems reliable, so I'm making the change. Note that the original creator of that category contributed for two days from an IP address, and only an educated native speaker (who's familiar with WP category structure) could verify the accuracy of those edits. -- Deborahjay (talk) 21:35, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)
I first found the category Eminyakeni. I saw in it some years and categorized the others there (which is logical, but I then found Iminyaka in WantedCategories and now I have the doubt about which of the users is right. Now that you know the problem, maybe you could find the solution. Once the problem is solved, unifying the categories will be easy. I agree with you that it is wrong to create categories in English, that's why it's very important to consult with speakers or not create any. If you look at my contributions here, you will see that I only created categories that are not disputed (and I linked them on Wikidata, which is important). --Metrónomo (talk) 22:21, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

Category name IYurophu Empumalanga vs. IYurobhu Empumalanga[edit source]

I created Category:IYurophu Empumalanga by Special:WantedCategories, but when I went to link it to Wikidata I saw the empty category Category:IYurobhu Empumalanga. As you know, redirects do not work in the categories. --Metrónomo (talk) 20:34, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

This pair of category names is a good example of how Special:WantedCategories is full of irregularities. There were and are existing categories and pages using either spelling of the Zulu word for Europe. When I consulted with a native speaker, User:Njabulo19, I accepted his suggested spelling and made the other variant a #REDIRECT page. I believe this is a reasonable approach to such pairs. As for redirects do not work in the categories - my understanding is the category name does function as a redirect, but to populate the new category each instance has to be retyped. Is that what you meant? Hence my remark above about being a fast typist with revisions. -- Deborahjay (talk) 21:45, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)
A Template:Category redirect could be a good idea. It does not necessarily have to have the same format as the English Wikipedia, it could be a friendly indication for users to be redirected to the preferred term. --Metrónomo (talk) 23:39, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

Categories about births and deaths[edit source]

I saw several categories in English about years of birth and death, but I can not change them because two different systems are currently being used: "Abazalwayo YEAR" (equal to "YEAR births") and "Abafileyo YEAR" (equal to "YEAR deaths") vs "Ubezalwa ngo-YEAR" (equal to "YEAR births") and "Ubefa ngo-YEAR" (equal to "YEAR deaths"). Which one do you use? Having the clear criterion can be unified all. --Metrónomo (talk) 22:23, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

You've discovered several of the variations in use. I need to study these and related words, and then consult a native speaker to determine which is best for each use. Since we've just worked on Category:Iminyaka (years), I want to focus on the births/deaths topic over the next several days. -- Deborahjay (talk) 22:30, 10 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

Off topic[edit source]

I am Argentine, my time zone is UTC-3, and you? I have a Wikimedia cloak in IRC (Metronomo). I think we can coordinate in the wiki but if at any time you want it, I can use the chat. I am in by Special:UnconnectedPages, with focus in the categories. I can not translate to Zulu, but I know a lot of templates and if you need a hand with them, you can ask for my help. Usually the small projects have problems with templates. I have collaborated before in other small projects and I usually leave them when I can not do more basic maintenance (interwikis, categories, templates, etc.). I usually do not create anything, I just organize what is already there. If there is a category model in the local language, I rename those that are in English and I make the ones that are missing (like born/death). If there was already an error, I would not know how to detect it or correct it, but a native speaker can solve it easily when everything is organized. When categories are orphan, it is difficult to know that they exist. I usually do not edit the articles, they do not usually have serious interwiki problems. Users pay more attention to the articles, they leave the categories. Since you have better knowledge of the language, I will trust your criteria. I think it's not wrong to use a tool like Cat-a-lot to move a category when it's been decided that there's a better name. Do you think there may be a problem with the flood? I'm also a bot operator, so if at any time you want to make a change that affects many articles, you can consider using it (if you need it, I can ask in Meta the bot flag for I just read your personal project about the categories, you can count on me. If there is anything I can help you, just write and I will come :). Cheers, Metrónomo (talk) 00:41, 11 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

To do: translate and customize Template:Welcome, so that new users feel that they are welcome. --Metrónomo (talk) 00:44, 11 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)
  • I'm an American Israeli (since 1984; previously Los Angeles sí, "se habla" ES but nowhere near as good as your EN!), time zone UTC+2. I'm a newbie at IRC; real-time typed chat is a medium I use regularly (e.g. Skype) also for its asynchronous capability (messages are saved), but in-wiki communications are superior for tracking the content re: mutual activities, for future reference and for transparency. PM is also a possibility (for rants ;-)
  • The technological tools are largely unfamiliar to me, so I'm unlikely to know how to exploit them. Before automating any process, I like to know the outcomes and trade-offs (e.g. I recently got rollback privileges in but not yet using Twinkle for quick deletion tagging so still do it the slow way :-/ SUGGESTION: As you scope out the present condition of zuwp, its particular lacks and weaknesses, I'll study your recommendations and prioritize those for implementation.
  • Access to native speakers is minimal and spotty, and I don't want to overburden the two new Users who've emerged since I've been working here. Recently I approached several of the board members of Wikimedia-ZA (South Africa), who didn't engage me on the topic of the zuwp past/present/future (and it appears that none are Zulu themselves). In late November they held an annual meeting (though I didn't attend via hook-up), and after they post the protocols, I'll retry contact regarding resources.
  • Some page and category names are underdeveloped (e.g. not yet interwiki connected in Wikidata) due to irregularities with their names. I'm searching online resources for authoritative spellings (e.g. names of countries!) my student dictionary lacks. Templates are desirable, we can evaluate the existing ones.
  • From your experience of similar Small Wikis and this particularly understaffed one - what mechanism can we use (besides our User talk pages and the several special-purpose ones I created) to serve as a proto-WikiProject with targets and goals? Already some of the prior clarifications with native speakers are "buried" on Talk pages.
  • Considering all of the above, my first request is to have topical stubs: Geography and Biography. Perhaps to already sort each by region/continent (focusing on Africa, less detail for the other continents!) and occupation? I've seen some existing in other languages. Compare the subcategories in Category:Stubs (the two geography regions' text are still in English :-/ then even better: the subcategories in en:Category:South Africa geography stubs. How do you suggest we organize this?
I suggest setting up or utilizing an existing place for discussing strategies and tactics (and move this discussion there). Your input is greatly valued! -- Hasta pronto, Deborahjay (talk) 15:12, 11 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

Project status[edit source]

That plan of action seems reasonable to me. I can work on the templates and follow their indications in the categories. I can think of a lot of things that can be done, some with higher priority. I think that the main page to centralize all comments should be Wikipedia:Umnyango wamgwamanda. We can also create other pages to coordinate the most specific actions (something like the wikiprojects or the task forces, but flexible): starting with one for the categories and another for the templates. There all the discussions on these issues would be centralized, the users we could make consultations, coordinate actions, etc. That way the comments are not all mixed or separated in different places. Its names could be something like: "Wikipedia:Categories task force" or "Wikipedia:Project/Categories", but in Zulu language. For most of my comments and proposals, I will start using Wikipedia:Umnyango wamgwamanda, but I can only write in English and I hope that does not scare or bother off native speakers :/. Cheers, Metrónomo (talk) 21:30, 12 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)

@Metrónomo: I'm glad to have your encouraging remarks on how this is developing. One necessary clarification: it appears that content (messages) on the Community portal page (Wikipedia:Umnyango wamgwamanda) are generated entirely by Wikimedia/Meta operatives, in the form of crosswiki (?) announcements. This remains true even after your much-welcome archiving. So this is why I "appropriated" Wikipedia talk:Umnyango wamgwamanda (Ingxoxo, second tab from the left, in the Talk page position) for concentrating the discussions at this point. What about a project "portal page" with a set of links to the offshoot pages for discussions by topic (as you suggest above) - or what format would you suggest? -- Deborahjay (talk) 21:51, 12 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)
That's because that page is listed in m:Distribution list/Global message delivery/Wikipedias and other similar pages. Some Wikipedia have a separate page for this type of messages, called "news" o similar, ideally as a subpage of the main. That may be the solution. --Metrónomo (talk) 22:04, 12 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)
I like that "ideally as a subpage of the main" - and if there's no need to consult another "responsible adult" (here?! where?), how about if you:
  • "Make it so!"
  • Shift the archives and recent content of Wikipedia:Umnyango wamgwamanda to that new page/address
  • Find models for an appealing Community portal page showing activity ideas, plans, goals, etc.
I'll help on the latter, and may I say: you know how to use your knowledge, and the is fortunate to have you aboard. -- Deborahjay (talk) 22:26, 12 uZibandlela 2017 (UTC)